award / demerit - system abuseable ?

[Graf Irrationale Zahl]

I've posted this already in a different thread, but because of no response II thought I try it one more time.

(Timeindexes in this thread are related to the HD-video on fileshack.)

Do you guys think the Award-Demerits/Faults-System will work without the possibility to abuse it?security failure:I guess a player gets this demerit if he is the closest to the red door and a zombie is entering the safe room (1:54-2:01Zoey opening the door and entering the room, 2:02-2:10 Louis gets 5 security failures is the closest to the door (you can see him at 2:06).possible problem: - Player A opens the door and gets in. Player B is behind him and notices that zombies are charging player A. B is closest to the door so he steps back and Player C (who was standing behind B) gets the demerit even if he was e.g. looking in a different direction.friendly fire/reckless:Player getting ff-demerits if they hit other player (red symbol with crosshair and human shape, timeindex 2:13 Bill).Player getting reckless-demerits if they step into someone elses fire (red symbol with hand, timeindex 2:13 Louis)possible problem:- Player A is static and 10 feet away from the moving Player B. A shoots B in the back, ff and/or reckless ? (You can see that it is possible to get 2 or more demerts per action (Bill shoots Boomer and gets ff- and boomer-demerit, 1:22)).- Player A is static and 50 feet away from the moving Player B. A shoots B in the back, ff and/or reckless ?- Player A is static, shooting but moving his aim from left to right. Player B is moving and crosses his line of fire from right to left ...or other things like:A jumping into the fire of a molotov cocktail of B.A blocking B in a room after B has lighted his pipebomb (don't know if player can put out the fuse).TAs and TKs playing with their friends on their servers and provoking situations where they easily can get awards (reputation is permament!).a.s.o.... I really love the idea of a reputation system that stops player from disturbing the fun of others but it would be horroble if payer could abuse the system to "blame" others or to build up a false reputation.

[Chronos]

It definitely won't work perfectly but I think it'll be pretty accurate about who was in the wrong most of the time. The worst is probably going to come from a confusion between 'friendly fire' and 'recklessness.'

[Deltus]

The worst is probably going to come from a confusion between 'friendly fire' and 'recklessness.'

But you wouldnt want either on your team, so just kick anyone with more than x ammount of TK's/month

[ZombieCheeseMan]

The ability to get a merit from giving a health pack to another player could also be abused if it gives the merit more than once if they keep giving the health pack to each other. In theory the two players could get a false reputation for being generous and have a more likely chance of getting into a game. Play nice please I'm new : )

[dontleave]

Yeah, except there's no special award or unlock for doing this, only what you can see on your merits page, so pretty much I don't see anyone doing this unless they're COMPLETELY obsessed with merits. If it unlocked a golden Uzi of doom I'd be right on it, but this isn't the case. Smacktards who run into fire can easily be kicked anyhow... this isn't a game where you can sit around give eachother health packs, because you're bound to die anyhow, and anyone I see doing that will get a Kick vote, hopefully that counts for something with regards to reputation.

What would be nice is with nades, make it so theres an initial radius with you're nade, and when you throw it, and theres no ally in that radius at the time when it hits the ground you should be fine and anyone that gets damaged by it should get demerits or whatever. Note I don't mean the blast radius because that is too big, somewhere between the blast radius, and the point where someone can safely see it and run away, and the throwable in question.

This further enforces the fact that you shouldn't have to strafe and move that much at all. EVEN WHEN YOU'RE BEING MOBBED, the only thing that makes sense for you to do is crouch and shoot, you can strafe while crouching, the way I see it every team damage you take while crouched on the same level as the attacker should be a demerit for them. It makes no sense that you'd hit them when they're crouching unless it was just an unlucky stray from a shotgun blast.

[Graf Irrationale Zahl]

o pretty much I don't see anyone doing this unless they're COMPLETELY obsessed with merits

I think you're right somehow, but what about serverplugins that e.g. autokick players when they commit friendly-fire 4 times in a map or maybe autoban players with a friendly-fire:saviour-blanace of 2:1.
Watch the quakecon no. 3 of 4, at 0:05 you can see that Louis is shooting and Zoey is just running throw his fire (Zoey is hitting Louis too so they both get ff).
Just imagine you play with a retard, tell him to stop blocking your way etc. and he jumps around you all the time until you get banned or something.
That's what I'm a bit afraid of...

If it unlocked a golden Uzi of doom I'd be right on it
or a chainsaw ... or a minigun ;)

[Psyche]

Updates? lolwut

[TheBump]

I believe the award system will be a bit abusable in the beginning but I also believe Turtlerock will balance/fix/patch these abuses pretty quick.
They seem to take so much pride in their product and how it is viewed upon by the gamers.

[Brazuca]

Of course it will somehow be abusable, look at Battlefield 2142, there was a pod glitch that could nail you over 4 points per second + 10 free points for every 10 points you get.

That's not only it, there were many other ways to easily increase your rank. There is also pistols + knives servers for people to score more points and increase their rank easier.

In all, yes there will be a way to abuse the system in someway.

Since TRS are going to wait until 08 to finish this game then the good thing will be that the game will come out alot more polished with less bugs as possible since they are actually playing it often and observing how others play it. The better the game is out of the box or steam then the higher review scores and bigger impact it will have when it is debut.

[Deadly]

2142 = EA = total suckage, i should know, i have it.


yes it will be abusable but im sure it will be fixed fast, i agree with brazuca

[Brazuca]

From what we seen from TRS as soon as they hear of a bug they will try to fix it within a week unless it's a very complicated one.

[dontleave]

Of course it will somehow be abusable, look at Battlefield 2142, there was a pod glitch that could nail you over 4 points per second + 10 free points for every 10 points you get.


Was? Damnit I missed out... BF2142 is awesome, the only reason I don't play is because I don't want to get addicted to it again. Quake Wars is a good substitute, but its sometimes too much Quake too little wars..

[USS_Stud]

Well one thing that really.. well... got my attention was in one of the gameplay footages. When 3 of the players were low on health and only 1 had a med kit. He used his med kit and got a "Hog"(pig) demerit. Now that's fucked. I know generosity is nice 'n all, but that's just ridiculous.

[TheStrife]

It's because he had like 85% health and 2 other players were almost dead when he used it. Remember, it's trying to promote teamwork.

[Graf Irrationale Zahl]

I also believe Turtlerock will balance/fix/patch these abuses pretty quick
I think so too. They are working hard on it now, so they won't neglect the game later.


Since TRS are going to wait until 08 to finish this game then the good thing will be that the game will come out alot more polished with less bugs as possible
That is exactly the reason why I'm not sad to wait longer ... after waiting about 10 years for Fallout 3 (and I guess it won't be that good) I am as patient as a turtle (rock).


He used his med kit and got a "Hog"(pig) demerit. Now that's fucked. I know generosity is nice 'n all, but that's just ridiculous.
On the one hand it would be really ridiculous to get a demerit for using a healthpack, if the rest of your team is just a bunch of beginners unable to work together and shooting themselves all the time.
On the other hand you are depending on your team, even if they are retards - like in the good old zed-movies: One knows what to do and has to pull his hysterical companions in arms out of their own shit ;).

Guess you guys convinced ne not to worry too much about the award-system.

[USS_Stud]

It's because he had like 85% health and 2 other players were almost dead when he used it. Remember, it's trying to promote teamwork.
Nope, just rewatched it. I think you were referring to Louis in the other video.

I'm talking about CityStreets_Cam, @00:24. Zoey(12%) and Louis(none) are low, but don't have anymore medkits. Bill uses a medkit with about 25% health and brings him up to about 90%. He gets a demerit.

So what? You get a demerit if you use a medkit around people with lower health?(???!?... ???!!??!)

Not that I'm gonna flip my wig over it, it's just in the long run, it's just complete total BS. I can see it now;
A medkit hog, joins your game. He uses every medkit he can find and gets demerits up the ass. You and him are finally low on health, he has no medkits, you have yours. You use yours and get a demerit.
See?

[iRelentless]

Maybe the demerit was for using the last medkit when someone has half as much HP as you, or less. Perhaps with a filter to not demerit if the difference is equal to, or less than 10% of max hp.

But still, what you mentioned could get old really fast if it happens, so I'm sure its something they'll think of, or maybe someone at TRS will read this topic and rethink how its worked out, if its something which could happen a lot with whatever method they currently use to determine that demerit.